Curse

hazygin · Jan 08, 2007, 02:31 PM // 14:31

things which are missing:

Line of Sight projectile spawning particle damage, IE: it will lay down the effect in a line to the target thus, making it more effective at longer range. IE: Different form of AoE

Player position based effect spawn: eg: for the next X seconds, every second the ground adjacent to you freezes for 3 seconds, icey ground slows enermy moment by 50%

the effect can be even a buff for your team, ie: lets say to have a skill which makes you lay down a local effect to make you and your team ran faster, but only in that space, thus more like a road/channel

Forced enermy moment: ie swap location with enermy. or
zombify! : 15, 1, 30
While hexed with Zombify for the next 5 seconds targets enermy moves with 50% speed to towards your direction unless they are performing a skill. zombify ends if you move.

Spell distance variation
Glyph of Vision: your next spell has 1.5 range
5,1,30

Brandon1107 · Jan 09, 2007, 12:54 AM // 00:54

I'm am going to try to create a proffession but i've tried coming up with a terrain manipulation proffession using wards but everyone was like "no it has a spell with fire and water, its an ele" so...yea

BahamutKaiser · Jan 09, 2007, 01:42 AM // 01:42

I do believe line effects have been mentioned.

Wards are terrain manipulation, that isn't a new type of ability, it is an idea for an old one. So make another thread about skill developement instead of processing redevelopment in an original ability thread.

The idea of a PBeffect isn't new either, see Balthazars Aura. Just because there hasn't been much elaboration on certain skill types doesn't mean that they are new ones.

And I thought I pointed out the hazard of skills which manipulate your opponents actions, also including moving them. Best example of this ability is the boss in Prophecies, giving this kind of power to a player in PvP is broken.

If you read what was already developed beforehand you might be able to contribute something useful.

Now ActionJacks idea is much more feasible. A gradual Terrain change which can be shortened any time during casting with an interrupt. But as it is much more potent than a ward, and could cause extreme advantages if unremovable, it should probably be double edged, so allies would be effected and harmed by the effect.

Brandon1107 · Jan 09, 2007, 02:33 AM // 02:33

but that would be like Rangers spirits (ex. mudder terrain)

BahamutKaiser · Jan 11, 2007, 02:36 AM // 02:36

Providing a slight advantage or disadvantage to a large area with a spirit is not the same thing as providing a terrain snare which spreads from your location gradually. It is a gradual spread from a characters location, it cannot be broken by killing a spirit, and it creates a obviously more determental effect than a spirit. It is like a Ward and a ranger spirit put together with some additional original material. Perspective.

draxynnic · Jan 11, 2007, 12:14 PM // 12:14

Updated. Reading between the lines, it looks like BK's essentially removed his objection to terrain manipulation, albeit in favour of actionjack's form rather than the original, so I've removed his objection from the list.

As a comment, forced enemy movement does have problems in that it can essentially turn the player subjected into a spectator. There are also ways in which it can be made VERY powerful - for instance, dropping the target into a pile of traps, or drawing them through a line of traps, DOT effects, and other assorted nastiness. Most disabling skills do do this to an extent, but at least these just stop a player from doing what they want to do rather than force them to do something they don't.

'Course, it could still work... but it would have to be carefully balanced.

System_Crush · Jan 15, 2007, 11:01 AM // 11:01

I would like to add annother version of(angle to)
Spells with conditional effects based on caster (Gordon Ecker, post 34; Crom the Pale, post 35; System Crush, Post 67)
I was hoping for an own entry, but this will work too if people read the related post.

namely:
Charging self with an effect and releasing the effect

I would like to see charging effects that charge the caster with something, and are then released using another spell/skill.
Say you charge yourself with ethernal flame, when you release this affect with a skill that a targets an ally that ally gets aditonal ice resistance or deoes extra fire damage.
Release it on a foe then that foe starts burning.

Its like a glyph that works only for a spell that does nothing making it do something.

and:
Charging self with an effect that is added to the next spell cast

On the other hand you could have the charge spells charge you and accompany/overwrite the effect of your next spell you cast, that is sort of in support of the effect mentioned by Gordon but I am going for an effect that adds in aditonal, like casting a spell but the effect is delayed untill you cast your next spell.
Not only will that improve timing of spells cast but if you fist cas rotghosts flame on a foe(yes I know I misspelled it) which since the second last patch affect all foes in the area right? then charge yourself with burning gaze and then cast fire storm.
I know that using elementalist abiletys its way overpowered ad we can be gald burning gaze is not a charging effect.
But each foe hit by fire storm starts bruning and is kept burnign by the damage per second, each time firestorm hits a foe its charged with burning gaze, if that foe is buring it take sdamge and you gain energy.
This stacks for as long as fire stom lasts causing huge amounts of damage and fully regenrating your energy.

This would of cause have to be balanced when implemented and the effect you can charge yourself with should be much weaker than normal spells as you can chose to use them on 1 target or in a AoE freely.
Maybe you should sacrefice something for each target hit, there by making it less benefistial to use them in a AoE.

Giddeanx · Jan 18, 2007, 11:43 AM // 11:43

Admins can we get a sticky on this forum so it doesn't sink to obscurity. Its a very useful tool.

System_Crush · Jan 19, 2007, 04:23 PM // 16:23

Seems no one else has added it thus far, the rights for thinking fo it belong to Hirum.

Sangoma ("Witch Doctor")
with
Condition and hex reversal
Condition and hex prevention

Sir Tificate · Jan 21, 2007, 02:47 AM // 02:47

What about a class dealing with information/weaknesses and their exploitation?

See an enemy's skill bar, see what enchantments they have, see what they have armor against, see what they can see, see who they are targetting, then use skills that deal the specific damage they have the least armor against, remove a specific enchantment that is on a foe...

Also, skills for denial of information would be neat. Skills so that enemies can't tell when you are activating skills, so they can't tell how much life you have, so they can't tell if they are hexed or not... Something that would go into Illusion Magic, perhaps?

Lastly, skills that change effects depending on the conditions in battle, such as resistance to spells that increases against particular spells as they are used on you. EDIT: Other part removed. I agree with V

System_Crush · Jan 21, 2007, 01:50 PM // 13:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Tificate

or, coupled with about as many disadvantages as you can come up with, skills that change to other skills of your choice that you have unlocked for your profession.

Sorry but I gotta dispute with that, while skills like arcane theivery are okey because they affect skills on other people(skills already in the fight), using skills that allow you to change your skills during combat with skills you did not bring with you will enable a class to carry more than 8 skills, while heavy disadvantages would reduce the inpact of this for some skills there are still skills to get around that, long duration enchantments for instance, or enchantment removers(often people don't take them, but if they get a chance to take them withouth sacreficing a skill slot symbiot monks, elemantalists(especially earth) and several dervish builds would suffer severaly)

A skill that alows you to swich skills is broken because the skils you are swiching are not balanced towards being switched during combat, a skill that has multiple effects that where balanced with the use of that skill in mind would be okay.
And even if only skills belong to that class could be swiched, balancing all the skills of that class so that they would not have a major inpact when used agains a specific build(as that is likey why you would want to switch skills) would make that class rather bland.

On the contrairy I like the information hiding idea,
a smoke screen AoE skill that makes your foes unable to see what skills their target is using, or even if they are using a skills
It's a cool idea.

draxynnic · Jan 25, 2007, 12:32 AM // 00:32

Okay, I actually updated yesterday (although I'm reconsidering labelling Sir Tificate's second suggestion as 'polymorphic skills', as to D&D players that may make people think of shapeshifting, which is a seperate entry on the list) but I thought I'd weigh in with my own comments:

One of the guiding principles in GW is that, once you go into an instance, the only thing that matters is the build and how well you play it. It doesn't matter if Player A has several million XP and every skill in the game unlocked while Player B has only unlocked the skills they need for the build; if players A and B are using the same build, then the only difference between them is their skill level (one could infer that A will be a more experienced and therefor better player with the character than B, although this is not necassarily the case). For maintaining this principle, I don't see anything being introduced that will be based on what skills has been unlocked by a character, just what you've brought into an instance with you. (And this isn't even mentioning PvP characters and heroes, who by their nature have every skill you've ever unlocked unlocked for them.)

That said, there are some skills out there which, reading between the lines, seem to allow the user to have some control over their use. Consider Starburst and it's good twin Healing Burst, for instance: Both seem to have two versions - a relatively cheap single-target effect, and a more expensive AoE effect. While the player doesn't have direct control - the character will automatically choose the AoE effect if there's even a single additional target, and in pure energy-efficiency terms it's often* a good idea - the character can choose to take the single-target option if it's clear the extra energy for the AoE effect would be a complete waste.

So what could be worthwhile is having skills which have two forms they can take. This would require some sort of toggle, which given the mechanics of Guild Wars would require an additional skill (although this could and probably should be one that's completely free to activate - the only cost associated with it is the space on your skillbar) available to all classes. Use of this skill before casting a toggle-able skill uses the non-default form of the skill - for instance, a non-default form of Starburst or Healing Burst could force the use of the single-target effect even if they are multiple targets available.

*A single-target Starburst does X damage for 5 energy, while a double-target Starburst does a total of 2X damage for 10 energy - which has the same energy efficiency as the single-target version, and any extra targets past the second are essentially free. However, this doesn't take attunements into account, which I don't think trigger off the extra energy loss - thus, a Starburst with Fire Attunement up costs 3 energy for X damage or 8 energy for 2X damage. Another loss of efficiency comes from overkill of a secondary target (although with offensive skills, often the important thing is that the target is dead, and a bit of overkill is a good trade), or, on the case of Healing Burst, overhealing (the monk is hit by an arrow for 1 point just before casting a Healing Burst that otherwise wouldn't trigger the condition) and the lack of the Divine Favour bonus on secondary targets for primary Monks.

BahamutKaiser · Jan 25, 2007, 04:54 AM // 04:54

An alternate function skill is 2 skills, simular but different. The added diversity is naturally an unfair advantage. The only skills which should be considered for multifunctionality are those which lose their original function once they are used, of these there is only one example.

Often pet control has been suggested, and instead of adding additional control interfaces they could alter Charm Animal to allow pet manipulation and control after the animal has been charmed. This is specifically a control feature and not an additional attack. There are some other ways to make skills which would perhaps toggle "ON and OFF" like perhaps a shapeshifting feature, but besides that I wouldn't consider any multifunctional skills, especially if they offer 2 different attack skills in one, ever how simular they may be.

With multifunctional settings you could very well say any number of skills have multiple options, like Fireball and Flare in one skill slot, which is basicly what a toggled starburst is. Or they could toggle Shard Storm and Ice Spikes, or Eruption and Unsteady Ground, or Firestorm and Searing Heat. Your offering 2 skills in one, even if you cannot use both functions at once, it allows more variety, and an unfair advantage in options. I have to say it's broken, there are ways for it to work in particular features, but not what your interested in.

Teger · Jan 25, 2007, 05:15 AM // 05:15

a few things like this have already been posted, but mine is a little diffrent....

Anet sort of dabbled in "area controll" with the rit, ie; controlling a set area (around the rits spirits), and makeing it difficult for an enemy to assualt that poisition. I think it would be sort of interesting to take that a step further, and make enviormental effects. For example; that annoying "Miasma" from shiang jea in Factions. Imagine being able to make a couple patches of that around your GL in GvG...only problem is that you could catch it too. Essentially, varied enviormental effects, some like ranger spirits, and some completely diffrent.

Also, a *true* stealth concept. I think its agreed that Shadow Form was anets way of saying "your invisible! people cant hit you! Except...the engine dosent allow for invisable sins, oops >.>" Ofc, now that we have seen things like "invisable dervs" in ABs (glitches with form skills, ect), it would probably be possible to use the existing form mechanics...and just have a completely transparent texture...just an example here "Cloak of Night Elite Form 5e/2c/10r For 10...35 seconds, you become invisable. This form ends if you take damage, become adjacent to a foe, attack, or use a skill. This skill is disabled for 60 seconds"

BahamutKaiser · Jan 26, 2007, 04:44 AM // 04:44

I think there are a great deal of Location spells, which almost all of them suck, Now if it takes 15-25 energy, and possible exhaustion to cast a relatively simple damage on a small location, how are they going to balance a Locational "Condition"? It really isn't anything different than Wards, in terms of an advantage or disadvantage on a small location, and yes, Binding Rituals are already a significant source of minimal or brief effects on a large area.

I say there is alot of work to be done fixing the DoT spells and expanding Locational effects on Elementist, adding to it, not moving onto something else.

As for Stealth, for the most part, it is either going to be fairly weak and ineffective, or fairly strong and overpowered. You can target your foes by simply hitting "c" and "Tab", blocking this function is overpowered, allowing this function makes invisiblity basicly a gimmic. There are some creative ways to do it, but there arn't any legitimate applications to what you can chose from.

draxynnic · Jan 29, 2007, 11:39 AM // 11:39

Actually, there could be ways to do it. One way to do it could be to make it so that 'stealth' makes you invisible to anything outside your aggro bubble. Not much use at first use glance, but I can think of a few tactical applications, but it's still fairly easy to catch someone using it. Hardly a must-have, but it could still be useful... maybe.

It is entirely possible, however, that they have tried and decided it doesn't work. Certainly, one big problem with having stealth with the engine as it currently is is that you can't target the ground - if they can't be targetted, you could know exactly where they are and be unable to do anything about it unless they happened to be near a valid target, when theoretically an Ele would respond to such a threat by simply bombarding the area with AoE effects.

Aeon_Xin · Jan 29, 2007, 05:20 PM // 17:20

Ok, this is a type of thread I was looking for, except that everyone gets over winded, no offense, but it's alot of reading(so if I repeat something, my appologies)
Here are some ideas with short descriptions.

Whips: Increased melee range(variable per item length).
-Disarm ability, attack(and attack skills) are disabled for X time, and benifits of weapon removed for that same time. (Half casting, E+5, Ench, all that)
Maybe considered caster class.
Could Dual as below..

True Dual Weapons(Referenced in my battlerager as gloves/gauntlets)
(http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10108880)
Each weapon would do half damage, but this would allow for mixing and matching of upgrades/modifiers/appearance. (IE 14-22 overall would be 7-11 each)

Polearm Weaponry, Ranged Melee(multiple opponents with skills)

Rapiers and similar Fencing weaponry
-Piercing damage
Increased range skills(lunges/thrusts)
(not so big of an idea as a cross between warrior weapons and some assassin mechanics)

MountedRiders
(An pet simalicrum(spelling?), but Pet and Pet armor are items req'd in your inventory and/or skill bar)
Speed increases/skills
Leg hits increase
Upper body hits decrease
(The above 2 are for melee attackers, opposite would hold true for ranged attackers)
Healed/Listed as one character, mount not an ally.
Could be rigged for archery or physical combat, or one big meat shield)

(Ideas are definately raw, though I won't be checking up on this thread, so feel free, and don't belittle me, won't be here to read it. Just hope someone can find some inspiration, or work an idea into something usable)

actionjack · Jan 29, 2007, 10:59 PM // 22:59

Aeon Xin:

Whip with Disarm? A D&D player?

Sorry to be a BK, but I will refer to my old CC
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...d.php?t=135036

As it have something about Dual Weapon and Rapier there.
(I also have something about mount and pole-arm, but will leave it for now as still attempting to rewrite that one)

---------------------------------------------------------

On stealth. From some experience, I would say some dos and don't about it.

-Its relative easy to work but PvE and even PvP, but making it work for both is the the tricky part. And as the skill system in GW goes, it need to work for both.

-Be sure you won't get the one-hit-stealth kill with a stealth skill, as it is very bad for play experience (especially in PvP)

-Be sure to weight in the negative effect of stealth. Things like slow or no moving, no attack, energy and time cost, etc.

-Depend on how stealth is done, but if do have multiple hidding skills, be sure to make it so that one can on just repeatly reuse it over and over again (again, to avoide people in PvP who would just hid all the time )

-Can have associate skills with the stealth, skills that could be only use in hiding.

-Think about the advantage and effect of stealth. I see it as having both offensive, defensive, and movement use, but as something not easy to pull off.

draxynnic · Feb 04, 2007, 07:00 AM // 07:00

Updated (and bumped)

I've rolled the polearm and rapier suggestions into one category ("Reach" weapons, to use a D&D term), since specific weapons are getting close to being a specific concept rather than a general idea, and your suggested skill types for the rapier involve longer reach. (That said, riposte-type skills are also associated with rapiers...)

System_Crush · Feb 05, 2007, 11:41 AM // 11:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by draxynnic

* Condition/hex removal (System_Crush, post 69)

Lol!

doesn't that seem Like a odd sugestion?

No I definatly said reversal: post 69